Protestors, Allies, Fighters, Keep On – #BlackLivesMatter – By Eric Toribio

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Then readers will be lost. There’s another post coming this afternoon too.

Mark replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Black folks here in the US are not practicing cultural marxism! They're protesting against 400 years for systemic structural racism of hate, division, terror, and murder. I'm not sure who is practicing cultural marxism. I'm not sure that fighting against that type of historic oppression qualifies?

Stephen J replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

So it is OK by you if these thick socialists come to Worcester and trash the place, not forgetting to rip down the statue of Edward Elgar, because he had the audacity to create some beautiful music. Not only that, he was a whitey! The sad death of the criminal George Floyd at the hands of a sadistic copper in America, does not licence marxist morons like Gary McFarlane or his agents masquerading as fighters against an injustice from destroying OUR history. Where I live is about two miles from where William Wilberforce, following a twenty year campaign finally persuaded the then prime minister that England (yes that is a nation) would not only stop trading in human beings (it was not only black people you know) , but order the Royal Navy to go in and actively stop its consequences. It culminated in the US civil war which destroyed a confederation, and left a vacuum for an empire. Actions have consequences Hamish, if you destroy history, you deprive not just yourself but your children of the future. I am all for reason, and if there is a reason for someone to complain, they should take that to some form of arbitration. A good example would be the murder of Stephen Lawrence, where the police did not bother to do their job, his parents took them to the courts and an enquiry damned just about everyone from the government down. What they did not do was trash Eltham. Please don't glorify violent marxist agitation, it is not necessary or constructive. And finally, the point of photography is to create beauty not to document lies, if I want to see gritty reality I will go and buy a book of gun porn by Don McCullin.

Terry B replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Sorry, Hamish, but I think that this was an error of judgement in giving a platform for political protest. I just hope that we won't see a reversal in the spread of covid-19 following their irresponsible behaviour, we're not out of the woods yet. Then who should relatives of those who may subsequently die, blame? The US policeman who was responsible for the death of George Floyd in the first place, or the actions of protestors who, by the current law, were not going lawfully about their protest? I don't see anything wrong in lawful protest, but their actions won't resonate well with the majority of law abiding people in the UK who have willingly, although probably begrudgingly at times, accepted the need for the Goverment's lockdown policy. If this is to be all undone, then shame on those responsible, for the damage done will be to the whole country, many of whom will have been entirely innocent, even if they may initially have had sympathies with the cause, but not their method of execution. As for Churchill, by all accounts he wasn't a particularly nice person, but he was the man for the times. Having to fight against appeasement politicians he alone was able to galvanise the British public to resist Nazism and which subsequently led to the annihilation of Nazism and the freedom of Europe from the jackboot. Why should today's protestors take this on board? Well, from what has come to light in subsequent historucal research, coupled with what we know took place in the only territory occupied by the Nazis, the Channel Islands, we know exactly what Hitler had planned for the UK. The simple stark truth is there would be no black people, along with all the other groups the Nazis classed as inferior and hated, in the UK today to protest. It hasn't been an easy road, but the UK has been on a trajectory to eliminate equality, and for the most part has succeeded, but inequality remains, nevertheless. But the UK is not the USA. and we shouldn't allow ourselves to be convinced otherwise. Once slavery was abolished here there were never any positive anti-black laws as was the case in the US. Somewhat long, but I felt a reasoned response was in order, rather than my simply saying I believe your judgement to be in error.

James Johnson replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Signed up for the Patreon. Good on you for standing up for the right thing, Hamish.

Nick replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Lost a loyal reader. You are all just a bunch of sheep.

Nope replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Sorry, but when the entire system - government, police, corporations, media, and so on - bend over backwards to not only support your cause but cover up your violence, and when the public is held ransom to say something - OR ELSE - your claims of experiencing structural racism seem laughable.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

It’s totally false to say all BLM protestors are all “thick socialists”. Monuments can be repaired - and those that represent less palatable parts of history put in museums where they belong. No one is destroying history, it will still belong in books and museums and other sources that can educate people. I’m not glorifying violence, I’m amplifying the voice of a black man who attended a peaceful protest in the hope that he can help action change.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

I believe that history will favour the the balance of the opinions of those who are protesting. Some actions may be seen as questionable, but ultimately the outcome of these protests will be the betterment of our society.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Thanks, James

Ken replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Ignorant

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

meh

Stephen J replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Nothing peaceful about destroying OUR history, or desecrating the memory of those who ACTUALLY died fighting fascism (the Cenotaph). I specifically picked out one of the socialist agitators, I did not allude to the gullible blind followers who cannot see what is underlying. If the demonstration had been peaceful, it might have had more power, instead it has merely precipitated the erosion of any support that Mr Floyd might have attracted through his torture. Trashing the neighbourhood does not bode well for the "matter of black lives".

Stephen J replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Maybe you should amplify the voice of this black man: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UoA2RHLlww Year zero freaks have no intention of furthering the cause of "black lives", they are only interested in undermining our history, which of course leads to the destruction of millions of ordinary lives of whatever colour... This has been very well documented throughout the 20th century and the millions of deaths that ensued.

Soloman khan replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Shame on you, you soulles waste of space.the pressing dire needs of society with it's deep state and looming disaster is a topic that needs addressing NOW .you can go forth with your camera and film away from people that are brutalised and oppressed, and happily you won't be missed.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

The actions of individuals within the protests do not represent the the views of the whole. The majority of BLM protests have favoured peaceful action, as far as I can tell. Unlike the right wing thugs who have descended on the capital today.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Stephen, I vote labour. But just because I vote Labour doesn't mean I believe in every word and perspective found in the labour party. The same goes for people who vote right - I'm sure not everyone who voted Tory agrees with the warblings of the extremities of the party. I haven't watch that whole video, I agreed with some of what I heard, and didn't agree with other parts of it. That doesn't mean I don't find myself on his side of the fence. My vote is simply for equality for black people. I also agree with the right to protest. Because of those two factors, I found myself more than comfortable amplifying Eric's voice.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

The problem is complex, I don’t think anyone is disputing that. But if inroads are made when it comes to inequality within society, then many of the underlying issues will be tackled too, or at very least be made easier to tackle. I think it’s a little sweeping to suggest ignorance on the part of all protestors. There will be many perspectives and opinions at play within protestors.

Stephen J replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

I agree Roger. What we are seeing though is not related to the cause of "black lives" it is a concerted effort to destroy our history and pervert the future through an attempt to destroy our environment. Never forget that socialism and everything that leads to is pure evil, and it will eat black people along with everyone else. Millions of ordinary folk have been wiped from the planet by socialists and their gullible adherents. Up to this point, Hamish has been creating, participating in what is known as a "little platoon", a club of people that wish to relate to each other in a very specific pursuit, the cause of film photography. If I want to read about a group of socialists bent on the mindless following of a dead man with a beard, I will join another little platoon.

Roger B replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Well said, Hamish. From where I sit in the US, however, it's hard to overlook the stampede of privileged, aging white politicians to coopt the authenticity and the drive for remedy seen in this movement, for their own Orange Man Bad agenda. Watching the two head honchos of the US Congress don the kente cloth of the Ashanti, the African kingdom that arguably made the most profits from the North American slave trade ... that kind of pandering is offensive, and unforgettable.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

You have a very different understanding of socialism, and a very different perspective on what is going on here to me. I respect your opinion as an opinion, but I totally disagree with everything you are saying.

Stephen J replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Funnily enough Winston Churchill said possibly the most important thing about socialism that anyone has ever said, and it is why he is so revered, however odious his personality. :et's face it politicians are creepy folk at the best of times. What did he say? “No Socialist Government conducting the entire life and industry of the country could afford to allow free, sharp, or violently-worded expressions of public discontent. They would have to fall back on some form of Gestapo, no doubt very humanely directed in the first instance. And this would nip opinion in the bud; it would stop criticism as it reared its head, and it would gather all the power to the supreme party and the party leaders, rising like stately pinnacles above their vast bureaucracies of Civil servants, no longer servants and no longer civil.” Under real socialism, we would see just how much "Black lives matter".

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

I think you are conflating equality and communism, and I don’t follow why

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Equal advantage, not equal disadvantage. These people are fighting for the rights of black people to be treated the same as white. To be given the same advantages.

Stephen J replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

They are. We have equal rights in this country, and have done for several hundred years. It depends what you mean by advantages? Such things are not given, they are built up over generations, and if you keep trashing your history, you never build any capital. My son in law is Keralan, and his father drove an underground train, he has made a lot of cash providing companies with websites. My nephew is married to an Indian girl whose parents were kicked out of Uganda, her father worked in a shoe shop, she runs one of the NHS trusts. Another niece is married to a Moroccan who has lied and cheated his way through life, and she lives in a grim north London flat while he spends her very small inheritance on a failed chicken farm in Essaouira. The fact is that we are the product of sexual intercourse, which is as near as dammit completely random. You just cannot justify grading people by colour, there are far more variables, the old trouser tadpoles know no boundaries. The nigh on hundred million people that died following the efforts of one of Marx's disciples Mao Tse Dong, were all yellow, what kind of advantage did their children derive from that sacrifice, apart from slavery? BTW: I do not think that it is necessary to try to demean my views by suggesting that I mean something other than what I have written.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Not at all, we’re just on such a different page I just don’t understand much of your point. Equal rights, perhaps (though I would debate that since not even poor white men had the vote 200 years ago...?). But that’s not what I said - I said equal advantage. To be treated equal, respected as equal, to have equal opportunity. If you can’t see discrimination in our society, you’re just not looking hard enough. And even then, if you couldn’t see it, where do you think such a widespread feeling within the black communities comes from. Do you think vast swathes of people are just imagining that they are being short changed by society? Are you suggesting that the racism they are protesting against is just a figment of their collective imaginations...?

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

You should let the actions of a tiny minority of protestors tarnish the view of the whole purpose. Also, I set the brief based on seeing Eric’s images and Eric fulfilled that brief by supplying them with these words. I did not ask for an unbiased photojournalist in piece, I asked him to document his personal experiences and opinions. This website is a blog, not a news outlet. A blog the documents photographic experiences, this to me is exactly that.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

Thanks John

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

That certainly sounds a little more like the socialism I subscribe too. Thanks, Pete

Des McSweeney replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

god bless Dennis Healey, gnarly old dog of the Labour Party and thoughtful politician

Pete replied:

Comment posted: 13/06/2020

I met him once in the gardens of the Alhambra. We got chatting as we were staying in the same hotel and we were both shooting with an OM2N. Lovely bloke and keen photographer. Highly recommend his autobiography. Best wishes to all - and thanks to Eric for his post.

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 14/06/2020

Thanks, Dan ????

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 15/06/2020

Empathy, sympathy, humility, a sense of injustice, a desire of equality, an understanding of what equality for black people means as part of a bigger step to a fairer society, a desire for a fairer society... all of which come from my left leaning tendencies, I suppose.

Soloman khan replied:

Comment posted: 15/06/2020

Well said hamish, may GOD bless you for taking a stand.it's an unfair unjust world ruled by greedy heartless ppl, we all need a collective concience to remedy the horrors of history, for the betterment of everyone. A peaceful safe and fairer society that evoke's love trust and mutual cohesion.????

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 15/06/2020

????????

Hamish Gill replied:

Comment posted: 15/06/2020

Thanks Richard, appreciated!